How I Became Athlete at 40 | Michelle Boyd

Natasha Nuytten: Welcome to another episode of Human Side Up. I'm Natasha Nuytten, your host, CEO at Clara, and here we celebrate the rule breakers and the change makers who refuse to accept the status quo. Today, I am happy to introduce you to Michelle Boyd, who is a woman who's rewriting the rules both in the boardroom and on race courses. As a president for Tri It for Life, Michelle is transforming how we think about mentorship, resilience, and what's possible when we dare to push our limits. Michelle's story is fascinating to me because she's living proof that leadership isn't just confined to one single area. By day, she's the director of healthcare careers and workforce development at Atrium Health. She's building an inclusive pipeline that has reached over 50,000 students and professionals, but it's through her triathlon mentoring that she's really discovered something very profound, which is that same grit and strategy and community support that gets you across the finish line can also break down systemic barriers and create really lasting change. What makes Michelle's approach unique to me and so compelling is how she connects the dots between personal transformation and professional impact. Through Tri It For Life, she's not just teaching people to swim, bike, and run, she's really showing them how to architect their own paths of opportunity, challenging their perceived limitations, and discovering that sometimes the biggest breakthroughs happen when we're the most uncomfortable. So get ready for a great conversation about resilience, mentorship, and that sometimes the most radical thing that we can do is to help someone else believe that they can do more than they ever thought they were capable of. 

Natasha Nuytten: I'm really excited to have this conversation with you, and I appreciate you making time, so thanks for being here. 

Michelle Boyd: No problem. 

Natasha Nuytten: All right we always start the podcast with one simple question. Maybe it is simple, it's definitely not easy. And it is, what are one or two words, before we jump in, that you would use to describe yourself that we might not find on your resume or your CV, but that describe who you are, and when did you start to own them as true for yourself? 

Michelle Boyd: I would say two major words that were hard for me, two titles, that were hard for me to embrace, but I did. Okay. Fit mom and athlete. So fit mom came as a result of a huge health scare. So my youngest, I was pregnant, eight months pregnant with my youngest, corporate mom climbing the corporate ladder, husband already had another daughter that was four years old at the time, pregnant with the second, and I'm not gonna let a baby, a big belly, stop me from being successful. I was still wearing heels. I was still wearing high heels. And I found myself in the intensive care unit with an AFib heartbeat. And that AFib heartbeat was, the doctors felt like it was gonna lead to a stroke. And so I was admitted and they sedated me. I opened my eyes at one point and there were doctors around my bed with clipboards way back when, and my youngest is 21 years old, clipboards, because they were like, she's gonna have a stroke soon. With that, I had to do a 180. And I said, you know what? I gotta take care of myself because I could be dead and gone and I won't be able to take care of my children. I won't be able to take care of my family because I'm not listening to my body. So thus began my health and fitness journey, nutrition, I changed it all around. And I started feeling really good. And I was like, you know what? I gotta spread the word because there are a lot of other moms that feel the same way, right? They wanna profit their families and their kids and they want their kids to grow up and have the things that they didn't have. And so I started calling myself Fit Mom. Athletes came a little bit later. So my oldest and my husband played college ball and were point guards. So my oldest is 25 and she is a second generation. She's now a mechanical engineer, but at the time she was a second generation point guard, playing for North Carolina A&T State University. Are you proud? And so they always laughed at the way that I ran and I was not an athletic bone in my body. I came to Tri It For Life. I said, you know what? If I get 40 and I want to compete or complete my very first triathlon, oh my gosh, if they did not laugh at me. And when you are an athlete, once you register and you come to orientation and through our 12 week training program, we call you an athlete. And it is very uncomfortable at first. And so I did not own it, but by and by I did start to feel like an athlete as I learned the three disciplines to swim, bike and run. And when my family saw me cross that finish line, they never laughed at me and my athletic ability again. And so since then I've done at least three triathlons. I've done relays, 5Ks, and bike rides. A group of us are doing a duathlon on August 2nd. We're going to run a 5K and bike 20 miles, rolling hills. Fit mom and athlete. 

Natasha Nuytten: Nice. Thank you for sharing that. That is awesome. It's certainly health centered. And I know some of your work has been there as well. And now being the president of Triathlete for Life, the National Board of Directors, I'd love to clearly understand how your personal journey landed you there. Along the way as Michelle was becoming the Michelle she is today, what are some of the other experiences or milestones, whether it's around health and fitness or something else that have guided the work that you've done, whether it's workforce development stuff or whether it is the development of humans that seems to be a thread for you. I'd be curious how you in your own becoming landed in a place where developing other people felt like, oh yeah, that's my path. That's the thing I'm supposed to do. 

Michelle Boyd: I am an educator at heart. So undergrad, got my business degree from the University of South Carolina, and went to Gamecocks. But I fell in love with training and development as a retail manager. I fell in love with training and development. And I know that through training and development, if you teach and train, you will retain folks. And so I sought out to get my master's degree from North Carolina A&T State University in adult education. I come from a long line of educators. I just knew I couldn't do it in the classroom. That's not my ministry. But I knew that I would have an opportunity to teach people through education to be their best selves. And so in my day job that I get paid for, I am very much fighting for a strong healthcare workforce. And I wanna make sure that the workforce, that there's access to the healthcare workforce for everyone. I also want the healthcare workforce to mirror the people that walk in the doors. And so with that, then that translates over to triathlon training and the perils that women or the things that plague women every single day. We're pulled in so many different directions. And so with that, triathlons are not, women are not well-represented in competing in triathlons or multi-sport training programs. It's getting better, it's getting better, but we're not there, right? And so through Tri for Life, it's just a secret sauce that we have. We are able to help women conquer their mind so that they can cross the finish line. 

Natasha Nuytten: So that's super interesting. And I've never done a triathlon, partly because when I start running, I'm like 30 seconds in and I'm trying to figure out when I'm done. The swimming and the biking I could do, but the running every time, it's that mind game that I can't get over. But I do remember actually when I was, I don't know, very early 20s, a friend of mine who is an incredible athlete, and she did her first triathlon. And she invited me to participate as the photographer. And I did, which was amazing. It was super fun. So to watch these folks, just every stripe, and you have no idea who they are, you have no idea what their background is or what they do in the rest of their life. You just know that they have put in the time to take on this incredible challenge, whether it's a duathlon, whether it's like a little mini or it's a half or an Ironman, whatever. It's all incredible. And so one of the things you talked about is that women in particular, and I know you all serve women, especially through Tri It For Life. What are some of the, you're a mother of two. You have a big full-time job. You also are president of this National Board of Directors. It's wearing a lot of hats, and that's very common for women in work, right? Or in life, whether their work is paid outside the home or their work is not paid at home or someone else's home, frankly. How are you, what are some of the tips and tricks? You said you have a special sauce, and I don't want you to give away all the secrets, but I am curious how you help women find their path and prioritizing themselves as well as not taking away from these other things, but prioritizing themselves so that they can be their best selves to do this really hard work. 

Michelle Boyd: So we use a lot of the same sayings that we've heard over and over again. You can't pour from an empty cup. We talk about your health. Are you happy with your health? Are you, do you feel good, right? Here is one way that you can have some fun and take care of yourself. We talk about all of those things that'll be there. If you pass away today, Bank of America will be there. They will send flowers to your family. They'll be there. Sam's Club will be there. These organizations will continue to run. They'll just run without you. We give them the space to be themselves. And there are lots of sports associations, AAU basketball, or, I don't know, club ball or whatever. But many times, the folks or the trainers or the coaches, they don't have tissue with them, right? It's better get out there and yell and all of that. But what we say is, we just want you to try. Just try. Cry, and it's okay. And here's tissue, and talk it out. And yes, your husband is acting up now that you're not there in the evenings. You're training for this triathlon and he's feeling a little, what do you call that? Self-conscious, feeling a little less than. Maybe you're getting away. Remind him that you're not, right? Talk to your family, tell them where you're going, and then bring them all into the fold. And it's advice like that we give to women. And we just ask them to try. You're afraid, just try. And we hope that you'll Tri It For Life. 

Natasha Nuytten: Yeah, I think there's a really interesting concept for leadership in that, which is integration versus balance, right? We hear a lot of people talk about, oh, you need work-life balance, whatever, blah, blah, blah. It is one life. 

Michelle Boyd: It's one life.

Natasha Nuytten: It is one life. And I heard someone say that on a podcast, and I remember who it was, and I was like, that clicked for me, just to simplify it like that. Because you try to, at least I have found myself in the past trying to say, there's these different frameworks around hey, right now, there's more of this happening than there is of this. And it's the season, right? And you go through these things. And the reality is life's just a series of seasons, right? And I live in the Midwest, so it's a new season every three months, right? Literally. And so life looks different, right? And I think that this balance of those things is one thing. It's not that these things are mutually exclusive. There is a balance, but it's also integrated. That's where the real balance comes, because you can't just, you can't just be this version of this thing in each of these spaces, right? And to say that this other stuff isn't happening in your life and impacting how you show up is, it's just not true, right? Some people are better at maybe compartmentalizing a little bit, but it's still happening. And if you could integrate all of those pieces, then the way that you show up is that much better and that much more authentic. And so when we think about that lesson from leadership, I'm curious how these are two big commitments that you have. You have this real-world life that you spend every day doing, and then you have this, which is also real-world life that you spend every day doing. How do you integrate those pieces, working in healthcare, working with Tri It For Life, being a mother, being a spouse, being a sister, being a daughter, all of those things? What are your tips for integration and how you manage to find time to care for Michelle as you're walking through the day taking care of other people? 

Michelle Boyd: I call it, yeah, I'm with you, Natasha. I don't know many people that have work-life balance and do it well, but you can have work-life harmony. And I learned that term from a really cool CEO, Gene Woods. He's the CEO of a healthcare organization. He's really cool. And so for myself, I'll tell you, I told my kids, I am not mommy of the year. I want you to go ahead and release me of that title. I am not mommy of the year. I'm not gonna be a homeroom mom. I am not coming to do the bulletin board. I'm not selling the donuts, but I will get it. I will write your teacher a check for the fundraising goal that will help, right? And so I released myself from that. However, I did say that I'm gonna be the best mommy that I can be. I'm gonna take care of myself and I'm definitely gonna take care of you and I'm gonna have that harmony and I'm gonna be there and I'm gonna show up when you need it the most. And so with that discommunication, hey, I can't come, my oldest, Division I basketball, she played for a little while for Chapel Hill and then she went to A&T. And I said, hey, what are the most important games you want me to come to? Because mommy can't come to all of them. Oh, this one. Okay, let me put it on my calendar. I'm coming, right? And I haven't played anything before that. Same thing with my husband. And so I did the same thing. Hey, what's most important to you and when do you need me to show up? And I also had communication where I said, this is really important to me. Competing in this triathlon is very important to me. How can we work this out? So it's communication, it's harmony and it's talking to everyone and releasing yourself of these unrealistic goals. Cause June Cleaver, honey, that's gone. You can't do that.

Natasha Nuytten: That's it, I love it. I love that because, there are, and I'm sure that there are many sort of alternative frameworks around it that have similar core. But what you've really delved into is talking about the thing and setting the expectation because like, why is it that we feel like we have to do all the things to all people? 

Michelle Boyd: There's a song that's called, I'm Every Woman. And Whitney Houston and Chaka Khan, they meant no harm by it, but it's all in me, right? And we want it to be all that we can be. And guess what? As women, we took that literally. And then we started killing ourselves and it's called heart disease and it's called Go Red for Women. Every February, we celebrate Go Red for Women because of heart disease, cardiovascular disease that is plaguing women, right? And for someone to come up with a month to create awareness around it, that is something. 

Natasha Nuytten: Yeah, something's going on. It's not a one-off. Yeah.

Michelle Boyd: And yeah, we've always been taught that, especially black women, we've always been taught, I'm a strong black woman. 

Natasha Nuytten: And that's a lot of  pressure. And it's also a definition, right? Because I am a strong black woman. Yes. And. And? These other things are also true, that I do have conversations with the people in my life about, I can't do that right now. I haven't done it. I think what you've done is interesting. Tell me what's, where you want me to show up. You've been really specific in all the areas of your life. One of the ways that I have seen that happen, both professionally and personally, for me, is talking about here are some expectations that are things I have done in the past. And the reality is I don't have the bandwidth to do that, right? Starting this new company was like, hey, before we make this decision, before I make a choice, we need to talk about what that looks like, right? Because life is gonna be different. And I can't do all of these things. And it isn't, and I'm not walking into it saying, hey, if you can't get on board, I'm out and I'm gonna go do this anyway. No. And I'm not saying if you can't get on board, I'm not doing it. What I'm saying is, to your point, this is important to me. How do we make this work? Work with me, right? And I remember, professionally, we do the same thing, right? I talk with my business partners and I'm like, here are the things I'm responsible for. You're very good at this. Are you comfortable doing this piece? Because I can. I can, but I'm also doing these other things, and you're so great at it. Maybe that's where you can lean in a little bit. And another example of that is like the, who did I hear say it? Brene Brown. Ooh! God bless Brene Brown. There is this spectrum. Hey, I can show up 30% today. Can you get the other 70? Can you get the rest of the thing? 

Michelle Boyd: It's communication. It's being honest. It's communication, right?

Natasha Nuytten: And again, whether that's your conversation or someone the other day said, hey, for us, it's 100 and 100. Everybody's given 100% all the time, and if you can't give 100, you recognize that, right? Whatever your conversation is, whatever the framework is, in your professional life as well as your personal life, talking about it and being open about what's happening and what you can and cannot do is so important. And there are gonna be times where people are disappointed, like you can't avoid that, right? 

Michelle Boyd: Because they have a list of what they need, and we do too, and sometimes the two collide, and as women, it's okay to be selfish.

Natasha Nuytten: It is. And I was actually, what I was gonna get to, and I'm sorry I cut you off. I do that sometimes, my thought is, I have to, as soon as it comes into my head, it needs to come out of my mouth or I forget it. But the thing that I was gonna ask you is you have such a powerful, diverse group of female leaders with Tri It For Life. How have you seen this work in that environment? When you think about leadership, and you think about the fact that you have several leaders, several strong personalities, several strong, competent, capable humans, all working toward the same thing, but there's gonna be friction in some of, that's normal, because it's humans in the same room, right? How do you take that notion of here's what I've got, here's what I can do, and pour it into the beaker, so to speak, to create the chemistry that makes this organization special and unique in serving the population of women that you serve? 

Michelle Boyd: Natasha, it is a dance, because in the professional world, my day job, I'm a leader with a team of folks that are paid, we do performance reviews, right? This is their job, this is what they do, they're compensated. In the evening and on the weekends, it's tribe for life, and I'm working with women that are not paid, they are volunteers, and I'm telling you, if you can get volunteers to do their job, oh my gosh, you have made it, it is truly different, because what you gonna do, fire them? No problem, like a volunteer will leave in a minute, oh, I'm sorry, yeah, I got a lot going on right now, I won't be able to complete my assignments. And so your question was? 

Natasha Nuytten: It was, how do you take, so you have such a dynamic group of women working at tribe for life, how do you get everyone aligned around, okay, here's what's happening in my world, here's what I can do in that realm? And I'm actually very curious how you do that in your day job, too, right? Because leadership is leadership, wherever it's happening, and whether you hold the title or not, doesn't matter, it is that leading with integrity around getting people to do the thing and move in the direction that we've set as the direction. So I'm very curious about how, in those two worlds, you have accomplished doing that across such a diverse group of human beings in both of those spaces. 

Michelle Boyd: So at the beginning of each year, at the beginning, in my day job, we have planning meetings, weekly planning meetings, daily check-ins, daily huddles, where we continue to communicate and connect our daily activities with the organization's mission, vision, and goals. So with Tri It For Life, in January, we hosted a leadership retreat. And so that's where we laid out the mission, vision, and goals and where we are and where we want to be. And so what we had to do was have all of the leadership, the board of directors, we had to have, everyone had to be in agreement. And so with that, we lay out descriptions, job descriptions, what we want to accomplish, milestones. We lay all of that out, and then we check in periodically, right? So just to make sure that we are all rowing in the same direction as such. So that's the board of directors. So we have six chapters, three in North Carolina and three in South Carolina. We are also bringing all of them together in November for a leadership conference. And so with that's where we will lay out the vision of the organization and where we want to go and the roles that they could play. And we'll also ask them, where do you see yourself or your chapter fitting in to that role? And I believe you have got to hear. You've gotta be able, you've gotta lead and steer the ship, but you've also gotta listen to your crew because your crew is smart. You selected them, right? 

Natasha Nuytten: Right. 

Michelle Boyd: They're there to support you. So you listen to your crew and then you do it together. 

Natasha Nuytten: What do you do for prep work? What are you asking people to think about before they get there? And how are you facilitating that sharing so that it's not just we're all sitting in a circle talking about our feelings, right? Because a lot of leaders go, I don't have time for that. I have, like I was thinking about, I'm like, sometimes I get in a team meeting and I'm like, dude, I know y'all are busy and so am I. Like, let's move it along. Like you're using 47 words, I need you to use five, right? So we all have these moments. I'm just recognizing in my own self that I have this. How do you very practically get your team prepared, whether it's a day job or Tri It For Life, how do you prep them for those conversations? What are you asking them to think about first before they get there? And then how are you then rolling out that facilitation around, here's the goal and the objective. How do you personally, Natasha, align with what we're doing? How are you getting on board? 

Michelle Boyd: So I'll speak specifically about Tri It for Life. We ask them for their plans and their worksheet. Here's the mission, vision and goals. Here is what we expect of you. Like we have a program chair, we have a membership chair, we have a sponsorship chair and a gear chair. We have an executive director of operations, right? So we have one paid staff member that holds us all together. She is amazing. Hi, Mallory. Oh, but okay, she heard all of us chickens. So yeah, so we ask them for their plan. So in advance, we ask for the plan. These are the steps that you want to take to get there. And this is the support that I need, right? So they tell us what they need from the board, the president, vice president or whatever. And then we come to the retreat and we all talk about, every person talks about their plan and they edit based on what everyone else is saying, is sharing, right? So that we all come together so that we can roll in the right direction. In our monthly meetings, a week in advance, they have the agenda. Here's the agenda. Here's the topic. Here's the time. I love timed agendas because I cannot stand it when one person took 30 minutes to talk about something and now we've got three minutes for the last piece. No, so I have a timed agenda and I have people's names on there and you need to do a report out. If you don't have anything to say or you haven't made progress, that's okay. Tell me that, right? We're not gonna punish you. We'll ask you, how can we support you? But we're gonna hold you to it. Even though it's a volunteer organization because we have got to help these ladies cross the finish line and increase their confidence. 

Natasha Nuytten: Yeah. There are many things that I appreciate about that but the thing that I love that's very tactical and practical is that it is edited in the process, right? So it's not just, here's what I want. Here's what I need. It is, here's what I want. Here's what I need. Let me now take some input. Let me edit, readjust in real time and be responsive so that there is flexing, right? Because the reality is like the organization can only do so much. So how do we get everybody the best that we can? So I really like that editing piece. I think that's an important part of that process. So in thinking about how you arrived at that or maybe other things, what about your approach as a leader has evolved from your very early days in doing this development work with humans to the work that you're doing now, whether it's volunteers or your team that's being paid to be there. What has transitioned for you or evolved? 

Michelle Boyd: I think you hit the nail on the head. It's allowing people to edit, being flexible. And so 20 years ago, I was a very young, fresh out of college. Actually over 25 years ago. And became a manager. And became a manager. And I was, this is the goal. This is exactly what everybody has to do. And I didn't care who I stepped on to get it done. And I have nothing to do with the fact that you don't have a babysitter. It's time to come, work is work. And since then, I understand that people are multidimensional. And so there's one dimension that's here at the workplace but there's another dimension that's with their moms, their daughters, their wives, their partners, right? They have a love life. They might be triathletes, and so with that, I try to recognize the whole person and over the years. And what I know is that if you recognize and embrace the entire person, they will do more for you than you could ever pay them for. And so if someone calls and says, Michelle, I'm gonna bring, I'm only gonna be 30% today. My husband and I are getting a divorce. And he is really pushing back on me and I go, oh my gosh, I'm so sorry. So we take time in our meetings to talk about life. On Mondays, how was your weekend? Did you have fun? What did you do? We're always gonna talk about what you did on the weekends. You know why? Because we need to know who you are as a person, right? And then if you are able to bring your entire self to the office, then there's trust and then we get more done. So that's how I have evolved. Over the back, way back when I was like, work is work. We're not here to be friends. And now I'm not gonna sacrifice. I'm not gonna sacrifice the goals of the organization but I do know that this is a whole person. So yes, people skills. 

Natasha Nuytten: I love that you shared that, and this is not a diss on being younger. We've all been there. The reality is that when you're younger, I don't know if this is true for you and I've never been a man. So I don't know how it feels to be in that brain walking through the world. What I do know is that as an almost 50 year old woman, once I hit, like first I do know that as a human being, your brain's not done cooking until sometime between 25 and 27. Like I do know that's biology, right? And young women do tend to be on the front end of that developmental window and young men do tend to be on the back end of that. Like I do know that. What I also know, and this is specific to my experience but I think it has been echoed by a number of other people, is that as you become, as you're put into position of becoming, of being a leader, right? And some of us come by it a little more naturally because of the traits that we already have. Some of us come by it more like accidentally because we were pushed into it or maybe someone sees something in you and brings you to it. However you got there. When you first start, you don't know what you're doing. Like you have some instincts and you've done some things well and that's opened up opportunities for you. And so to your point, you are a little more here are the rules. Here's how the thing has to be done, right? It's more okay, I read this book and these are all the things that you're supposed to do and there's this framework and I'm gonna try it out. And there's nothing wrong with that. I'm a learner like that. I like to try people's stuff all the time, right? Because I can't make all the mistakes myself. I don't have time for that. Life is short. And it's okay to try a thing and then pass it off as you know what? Maybe that's not me. Maybe that's not what works for me. That's not totally authentic. My team doesn't trust I'm showing up because I'm just trying it on and it doesn't really feel like who I am. So let me try this other thing. And once you've tried, you've had some years to try a few things and you get a little bit older. It's why we have such reverence for those leaders in our world who have been around a long time and they're doing it well. It's because they've screwed up so many times and they've just owned it and learned from it, right? And I love that going back to this notion of editing, what are you, how are you gonna edit? How are you gonna edit Michelle? How are you gonna edit Tasha to get to the next version of the thing and grow and evolve in that way, right? And you do settle into yourself a little bit more because you've tried more things, right? Am I crazy? Is that it?

Michelle Boyd: That's not crazy. Yes, you go, ooh, wait a minute. Let me get the eraser. Let me erase that. Yeah, that did not work. No, that did not work. Let's not try that again. I love that. But what is so wonderful is in my line of work, I also work with college students that are pursuing a career in healthcare. And I'll tell you, Natasha, I've made so many mistakes. Wow, right? And I just go, man, that's not fair. I'm a first-generation college student. And I'm just like, dang it, that's not fair. These people, these folks have all kinds of mentors and dads that are judges and all these professional folks and they can just call and talk to them, right? And I feel like I am going through this maze and it's pitch black where other people have a lantern. Someone is holding a lantern. But because of that, I am able to share my story with so many people, right? And I can share it and I have street cred. And so they can't say, oh yeah, oh, Michelle, she's had it so good. She's just, that's just lip service. I can go no. Let me tell you what happened, right? And so I think, I don't know, there are just no mistakes in life. 

Natasha Nuytten: It's all, it all works together for good. It's making new mistakes, right? There's always room to make mistakes, but just don't keep making the same one. Make a different one. Yeah. Make a different one. Learn. Yeah. And I really appreciate that because, one of the things that we talk a lot about on this podcast, and one of the reasons why is because it is so important to me on an individual basis what someone has been through. But in a professional setting, it's not so much to tell me the details, right? Or if you come from a recovery background or something or therapy background, I don't need the war stories necessarily, though at some point I do want to know from you what you want me to know. But what I think is so interesting is what have you learned from what you've been through? Yeah. It's different than what's the hard thing you've been through? We all have a thing that we've been through. And, without relativism, that's not hard. It was hard, but that wasn't hard, yeah. Without the relativism of that, I think there is a legitimate, so are you more resilient? Are you more resourceful? Are you more gritty? Are you more proactive because of the things that you've been through, right? Like you started out telling us your story around this journey to being an athlete, right? Some things happen to you and you have some options, right? Are you going to let that knock you over? Are you gonna learn from it? Are you gonna try some stuff and see what the next baby step is? Or are you like, I'm just gonna jump into the deep end. However your personality is, there is this evolution that I think our lived experience, it matters in how we drive forward in our business. You lead differently because of what you've been through. That's right. As do I. Yeah. And our organizations are better because they have people who have been through other things that they can bring and connect dots between experiences and bring them to the table. And that's such a critical piece of leadership is like the stuff that isn't just the business stuff. It's not just what you learn with strategy and tactics. It's learning how you take all the stuff that you've learned and the bad things that you've done because we've all done them, right? Like we've all screwed it up and done the wrong thing at some point or said the wrong thing or didn't even know you did until someone came back and was like, what the hell was that? Whatever version of that, it's what makes you better. And so I'd love to just end on asking you a question about if you have any advice for young-ish, I'll say young-ish because I'm gonna put myself in that category, leaders who are walking into organizations wanting to create inclusive, dynamic, innovative teams and bring out the best in people. Are there any pieces of advice that you would give them on how to do that? And we've talked about a huddle, a daily huddle. We've talked about checking in on who they are as a person. Is there anything else you would add to that? 

Michelle Boyd: Ask me that question one more time. 

Natasha Nuytten: Yeah, is there anything- Is it creating a team or is it leading a team? It's leading the team. It's not necessarily making the choices of who you're gonna hire at this point. We're talking about you've got this team. How are you, or what advice might you have for folks to help them better build these inclusive, dynamic, innovative teams by pulling out their best people when they are trying to show up? 

Michelle Boyd: I think listening to everyone, asking for feedback and using the feedback, even if it's something that you don't wanna hear. And so when you ask for that feedback and that person gives you what might not be such good news, you need to show up in a way that makes them feel comfortable, give them that psychological safety. Take continuing education classes, take continuing education, professional development is key. So focus on podcasts, workshops, certificates, training that allows you to understand your own biases. Bias is real, okay? Do a lot of work on the inside. I always love the Myers-Briggs type indicator. It's an oldie but goodie, MBTI. 

Natasha Nuytten: It is, yeah. 

Michelle Boyd: But understand the difference between an introvert and an extrovert. And you need all of it. The organized person and the person that is all over the place but they still get it done, right? So make sure that you do the, so I guess I would sum it up by saying, do the work on yourself on the inside first and then make sure that everyone has a voice at the table. 

Natasha Nuytten: Yeah, I love it. I love it. I'm incredibly partial. This is literally, is that backwards? Invite everyone to the table. It's literally, I'm with you. I'm with you on that. That's great. Michelle, I really have appreciated this. I have a couple more questions for you before we wrap. One, is there anything I haven't asked you about leadership or women's health or you as a human that I should have asked you today that I did not or thought you wanna leave us with that we didn't get to touch on? 

Michelle Boyd: Leadership, women's health, oh, mentors. The importance of mentors. So many years ago when I first started my current professional position, I was feeling and didn't know why. I was getting reactions and responses to what I said and didn't know why. And so there was this one young lady that took me under her wing and she said, I wanna teach you the ropes. She said, you've got, she said, you've got the intellect. She said, we just need to polish you just a little bit. And so by and by, she mentored me so that I showed up in the workplace as myself, but respecting the culture of that work, of that workplace. It changed my life. And so with that, I would say every leader, even though you're a leader, you need a mentor and you need more than one mentor because we are multidimensional, right? And you need a mentor that can serve every part of who you are. And so it has been my mentors that have poured into me that I've really appreciated. And with Tri It For Life, we have athletes and we have mentors that train them and that hold their hand and help them cross the finish line. So that is very important. I can't say enough about mentorship. And as a leader, you need to become a mentor as well. Don't neglect that ask if someone has asked you to be a mentor. 

Natasha Nuytten: Yes, plus one on that, plus one. And might I get your take on this? A lot of times people, especially when they get to like my age, they're thinking about, I wanna, they're thinking sort of long-term, where do I wanna be in 10 years or where, they've got like this plan.

Michelle Boyd:  I'm 51, so I'm with you. 

Natasha Nuytten: Okay, we're right here, we're right here. We're the Gen Xers, it's happening, we're taking care of business. But we often think about having conversations with people who are 15 or 20 years ahead of us. And there's a ton of value in that, right? Because you can emulate that. But there's also something to be said for we almost always learn best, not in the theoretical sense, but like in the practical, how to get it done sense from someone who's two years ahead of us, right? Because they've just been there. They remember it. They don't have so much history to like to filter through all this stuff. And so I really appreciate your point around having multiple mentors. It might be in different areas of your life. They might be at different stages, right? Because listen, I get amazing things from the women in my life who were in their 70s and 80s. I love it. My partner's grandfather was married to a woman, her name's Phyllis. She is a little pistol. She is 86. She still has multiple businesses. She's still doing all the things. There's something about her that I love to learn from, right? But she's also that much older than me. She's got a whole lifetime between now and then and so sometimes having a conversation with someone who's just like maybe a little closer to where I am, there might be more of that practical empathy, right? I get it. What is your take on that? Am I, is that way out of line? Or is that, yeah, it makes sense. 

Michelle Boyd: No, it's great. And so then it becomes an exchange and where you may be strong and well-versed in one area, they may not, and where they're strong and well-versed in another area, you may not be. So then you complement each other. 

Natasha Nuytten: Yes. 

Michelle Boyd: Yeah, right? Yes. And so it's wonderful. It's wonderful. 

Natasha Nuytten: I love that. That's a really great point. Okay, my last question to you, because I did slip another one in there. Sorry about that. Okay. The last question is, how can we be helpful to you? Amplifying your work and or supporting what you're doing? 

Michelle Boyd: Shout Tri It For Life from the rooftops. We are a volunteer organization. We do have one paid staff member and we want to grow our chapters. And so where we are now is learning how to scale this model that we have. And so we're building capacity, building infrastructure that will allow someone, right now we have North Carolina, South Carolina, but what if there's a group of women in Georgia that says, hey, we want to do the same thing that you do. And so please help us spread the word. And if you have any, I don't know, sponsors or any organizations that would love to sponsor women competing in their first triathlon, send them our way because we got to pay our executive director. I love it. And we got to keep prices low. That's right. It's a 12 week training program. It's like a hundred bucks.

Natasha Nuytten:  Oh, that's awesome. Very accessible. That's cool. All right. Thank you so much, Michelle, for making time to chat with me today and for showing up as the version of you that you are right in this moment. That's awesome. I love it. Thank you. 

Michelle Boyd: Thank you so much, Natasha. I enjoyed it. ♪♪